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	<title>Comments on: Food III: refusing to choose</title>
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	<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html</link>
	<description>This Blog Sits At the Intersection of Anthropology and Economics</description>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6794</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:25:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The &quot;farmer&#039;s market&quot; here in Austin is a blatant rip-off.  Every Saturday, these people set up booths in Republic Park and sell their wares.
First of all, most of it isn&#039;t produce.  There&#039;s a lot of handcrafts and prepared items, like cheese.  But some of it is produce and it is undoubtably good, but not noticably better that what you can get at the upscale supermarkets.  The problem is that it runs 50-100% higher than the supermarket.
I guess the farmers figure they need to be compensated for trucking everything in by hand, but as a consumer I think I&#039;ll just keep shopping at Central Market (which claims to buy local when possible).
The whole &quot;farmer&#039;s market&quot; thing just seems like a way to separate do-gooders and food purists from their cash.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8220;farmer&#8217;s market&#8221; here in Austin is a blatant rip-off.  Every Saturday, these people set up booths in Republic Park and sell their wares.</p>
<p>First of all, most of it isn&#8217;t produce.  There&#8217;s a lot of handcrafts and prepared items, like cheese.  But some of it is produce and it is undoubtably good, but not noticably better that what you can get at the upscale supermarkets.  The problem is that it runs 50-100% higher than the supermarket.</p>
<p>I guess the farmers figure they need to be compensated for trucking everything in by hand, but as a consumer I think I&#8217;ll just keep shopping at Central Market (which claims to buy local when possible).</p>
<p>The whole &#8220;farmer&#8217;s market&#8221; thing just seems like a way to separate do-gooders and food purists from their cash.</p>
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		<title>By: BN</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6793</link>
		<dc:creator>BN</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Jan 2005 20:57:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>test</p>
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		<title>By: cmb</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6792</link>
		<dc:creator>cmb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jan 2005 18:48:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>It&#039;s bad enough that my friends consider food a moral issue (&quot;I was a bad girl today and ate a cookie&quot;; &quot;I was a good girl today so I can have this cookie&quot;) but now it&#039;s becoming a political issue as well. Today I ate an organic orange that was delivered to my door in the midst of a snowstorm. Was that right? Wrong? It was certainly juicy.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s bad enough that my friends consider food a moral issue (&#8220;I was a bad girl today and ate a cookie&#8221;; &#8220;I was a good girl today so I can have this cookie&#8221;) but now it&#8217;s becoming a political issue as well. Today I ate an organic orange that was delivered to my door in the midst of a snowstorm. Was that right? Wrong? It was certainly juicy.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott McArthur</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6791</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott McArthur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jan 2005 11:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&#039;when you decide to give away what a culture of plenitude and transformation makes available to you, are you not declaring yourself unworthy of this culture? &#039;
&#039;Can we say at least that the most important locus of creativity and innovation has moved away from the artist into the very thing the artist stood against: the marketplace? &#039;
Your hand is very heavy this morning Grant. SLAP!
I am not sure why you felt the need to strike. It was as if you perceived a mass movement towards ignorance and scarcity that needed to be STOPPED RIGHT NOW.
I donno. I don&#039;t think the market can be subverted by these things, even if they obtain the largest possible sanction. The Soviet Union failed, right? How is a voluntary organisation for market isolation dangerous? Like I say to agressive Christians, is your God so weak that he needs you to do this? Remember, he&#039;s God, neither of us can stop him. The same goes for markets. They simply are there and they can withstand these things.
And is self imposed restriction necessarily less creative? I think creativity lies in the individual and in exchanges between individuals (the market). The individual alone is still a source of creation, he does not become barren because he wont trade. Do you really think that only commerce can create?
In some ways you can imagine these &#039;attempts&#039; at market restriction as efforts at product differentation. The individual jumps out of the market to make something in secret and have something interesting to exchange later, all the while boasting that he has given up on commerce.
In this sense Van Trier is just trying to please the market by making something different. He is trying to be a better market participant wherther he knows it or not. It&#039;s pretty funny really.
PS - Did you see Breaking the Waves by Trier? He&#039;s a one trick pony (human cruelty) but oh what perfection in that sentiment.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;when you decide to give away what a culture of plenitude and transformation makes available to you, are you not declaring yourself unworthy of this culture? &#8216;<br />
&#8216;Can we say at least that the most important locus of creativity and innovation has moved away from the artist into the very thing the artist stood against: the marketplace? &#8216;</p>
<p>Your hand is very heavy this morning Grant. SLAP!<br />
I am not sure why you felt the need to strike. It was as if you perceived a mass movement towards ignorance and scarcity that needed to be STOPPED RIGHT NOW.</p>
<p>I donno. I don&#8217;t think the market can be subverted by these things, even if they obtain the largest possible sanction. The Soviet Union failed, right? How is a voluntary organisation for market isolation dangerous? Like I say to agressive Christians, is your God so weak that he needs you to do this? Remember, he&#8217;s God, neither of us can stop him. The same goes for markets. They simply are there and they can withstand these things.</p>
<p>And is self imposed restriction necessarily less creative? I think creativity lies in the individual and in exchanges between individuals (the market). The individual alone is still a source of creation, he does not become barren because he wont trade. Do you really think that only commerce can create?</p>
<p>In some ways you can imagine these &#8216;attempts&#8217; at market restriction as efforts at product differentation. The individual jumps out of the market to make something in secret and have something interesting to exchange later, all the while boasting that he has given up on commerce.</p>
<p>In this sense Van Trier is just trying to please the market by making something different. He is trying to be a better market participant wherther he knows it or not. It&#8217;s pretty funny really.</p>
<p>PS &#8211; Did you see Breaking the Waves by Trier? He&#8217;s a one trick pony (human cruelty) but oh what perfection in that sentiment.</p>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6790</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jan 2005 23:12:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>In an artisitic context, imposing some formal constraints can often be productive. Think about meter and rhyme in poetry, or even Hitchcock&#039;s Rope (one single shot). Playing tennis with the net down doesn&#039;t always make for a better game. (But the van Trier set of constraints seems more like a hairshirt than an interesting formal constraint.)
In life, where there is no audience and one is not creating art, such self-constraint is silly unless productive of superior experiences. If faraway food is better or in season, I fail to see how avoiding it improves anyone&#039;s life. On the other hand, I can dimly perceive why someone might adopt the Amish way of life (although it is so not me it isn&#039;t funny), because those constraints are related  in an understandable fashion to certain forms of community and contemplation.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In an artisitic context, imposing some formal constraints can often be productive. Think about meter and rhyme in poetry, or even Hitchcock&#8217;s Rope (one single shot). Playing tennis with the net down doesn&#8217;t always make for a better game. (But the van Trier set of constraints seems more like a hairshirt than an interesting formal constraint.)</p>
<p>In life, where there is no audience and one is not creating art, such self-constraint is silly unless productive of superior experiences. If faraway food is better or in season, I fail to see how avoiding it improves anyone&#8217;s life. On the other hand, I can dimly perceive why someone might adopt the Amish way of life (although it is so not me it isn&#8217;t funny), because those constraints are related  in an understandable fashion to certain forms of community and contemplation.</p>
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		<title>By: Ennis</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6789</link>
		<dc:creator>Ennis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jan 2005 21:18:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;m hardly an eat local person, but I did have a fascinating experience over the summer which makes me think they might have something.
I live in a painfully small town, with few decent restaurants, but a first class farmers market. Most of the stalls sell local produce. I got to eat green beans picked that morning, fresh from the fields. Oddly enough, one or two stands sell the usual off the plane/train/truck produce from across America and the globe. So I could eat local apples, or apples from Chile. Local asparagus or asparagus from california, etc.
I gotta say here ... the local produce made the other stuff taste like cardboard. And here&#039;s the odd thing - the local stuff wasn&#039;t heirloom. It was the same national breeds that are selected for looks and durability, but not for taste. Local farms here actually supply a large portion of the region. But even these plastic breeds tasted so much better fresh than shipped in.
I&#039;m glad I get fresh produce year round. But the quantity has come at a clear cost to quality.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m hardly an eat local person, but I did have a fascinating experience over the summer which makes me think they might have something.</p>
<p>I live in a painfully small town, with few decent restaurants, but a first class farmers market. Most of the stalls sell local produce. I got to eat green beans picked that morning, fresh from the fields. Oddly enough, one or two stands sell the usual off the plane/train/truck produce from across America and the globe. So I could eat local apples, or apples from Chile. Local asparagus or asparagus from california, etc.</p>
<p>I gotta say here &#8230; the local produce made the other stuff taste like cardboard. And here&#8217;s the odd thing &#8211; the local stuff wasn&#8217;t heirloom. It was the same national breeds that are selected for looks and durability, but not for taste. Local farms here actually supply a large portion of the region. But even these plastic breeds tasted so much better fresh than shipped in.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m glad I get fresh produce year round. But the quantity has come at a clear cost to quality.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Arnould</title>
		<link>http://cultureby.com/2005/01/food_iii_refusi.html/comment-page-1#comment-6788</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Arnould</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jan 2005 17:46:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The eat local, like the slow food movement are obviously pro-local.  And surely we recognize that not all food is created equal.  Were it not so, the entire appelation business in wine, for instance would be out the window.  But location matters in the production of food, not just wine, truffles and cavier being just two up-market examples, but oregon pears and new york state apples also come to mind along with italian olive oil and greek olives.   But it is also a blow back to corporate control over the food chain and the values of homogenization and marketer controlled segementation and product differentiation MNC control implies.  So I think this is different than van Trier&#039;s manifesto (a wanker indeed).  But it also does represnt plenitude by suggesting that all directions have merit as emplaced directions not merely as trajectories.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The eat local, like the slow food movement are obviously pro-local.  And surely we recognize that not all food is created equal.  Were it not so, the entire appelation business in wine, for instance would be out the window.  But location matters in the production of food, not just wine, truffles and cavier being just two up-market examples, but oregon pears and new york state apples also come to mind along with italian olive oil and greek olives.   But it is also a blow back to corporate control over the food chain and the values of homogenization and marketer controlled segementation and product differentiation MNC control implies.  So I think this is different than van Trier&#8217;s manifesto (a wanker indeed).  But it also does represnt plenitude by suggesting that all directions have merit as emplaced directions not merely as trajectories.</p>
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